Youth has forgotten the cost at which we got our independence

National Award winning director Tigmanshu Dhulia, who was in Lucknow for a private award function on Saturday, expressed pride at being born and brought up in UP and a city like Allahabad. “Although people think I am from Uttrakhand, which was earlier part of UP, I was born in Allahabad and also studied there. My family shifted to Uttrakhand later. But I consider myself lucky that I belong to UP where the Ganga-Jamuni tehzeeb takes precedence over anything.Hum isme itna range hue hain ki hum toh ab badalne wale nahi hain. Now we will make efforts to take forward this tehzeeb even more sincerely," he said at the function. Later, the 'Paan Singh Tomar' director talked to us about censorship in films and relevance of freedom in our country and what freedom means to him.
You've had run-ins with the CBFC in the past, and have aired your views about the censorship/certification process – what's your take on Prasoon Joshi being appointed the CBFC chairperson?
Prasoon is an artiste so I just hope and believe and pray to God that he doesn't go through all the conflicts which the previous chief went through. And for art's sake, I hope he works for art and not the ideology people generally talk about.
Besides one only judges thing once they happen. My only grudge, and it’s not against Pahlaj Nihlani or any other CBFC chief, is that the Board is biased. It has nothing to do with any political ideology or anything. It’s a personal thing. Probably the readers or the audience will not understand but they always favour the big producers, who get away with anything. A film like 'Befikre' or Aditya Chopra ki ek koi abhi aayi thi, usme smooches, kisses, sab kuchh tha. Ab unke upar kuchh nahi hota hai. I made a film 'Saheb Biwi Aur Gangster.' Pehli jab banayi toh censoring hui toh but woh theek tha as there were some sensuous scenes in it and we got an A certificate for it. But in the second one, there wasn’t anything of the sort. Ab chhoti movies mein kya hota hai ki satellite rights se jo paisa aata hai na bas wahi hota hai. Box office pe jo film chalti hai woh sirf cost of production cover karti hai. Toh jo satellite rights se paise milte hain wahi profit hota hai. Ab satellite toh Saheb....ka aaj tak nahi bika because A certificate mila tha. Toh, when I made part two of the movie, I told them bhaiyya hum isme sex-vex kuchh nahi dalenge. Ab inhone usko bhi A certificate de diya yeh bol ke ki yeh thematically adult film hai. I asked them 'bhaiyya what is thematically adult?' It's a mature love story with intrigue. It’s an above-30 ki film, still, they gave it an A certificate. So at times, I don't understand what’s with them. And those 3-4 big producers, they may show anything in their film, they will be passed. That is my problem.
So do you think there should be censorship in films?
No. There should be certification. Like it happens in Hollywood and other countries. No one will cut your film but yeh mamla thoda pecheeda hai in India because yeh thoda nayaab kism ka desh hai. We have people of all communities, sensibilities, so many languages and different religious contexts. I won't say that anybody should make just any kind of film and then let things go out of hand. An eye should be kept on the content but not on other things. As long as a film is not creating communal tension, danga wagiarah bhadak jaye aisa kuchh nahi hai usme, toh aap usko certificate de do na! If it's not hurting sentiments, religious or otherwise, and is not inciting people to do wrong, then give it a certificate. Indulging in moral policing is wrong. What are we wearing, what are we eating, where are we going... how should anyone be concerned with that?
Talking about your last film 'Raag Desh', why do you think the film didn't click with the audience?
Because hamare desh mein fake nationalism chal raha hai. Agar asli nationalism hota toh the film would have worked. I made a film on Netaji Subhas Chandra Bose and INA, I worked very hard for two and a half years on it, did full research on it. But still people didn't go to watch the film. Our audience needs to grow more. As a filmmaker I know I am growing. I know my job, I'm making good films. But our audience is regressing. The level of the audience in our country is really falling.
See it's very clear, there was a time when there was a director called Dada Kondke. His name is in the Guinness Book of World Records for the maximum consecutive hit films. He made films in Hindi also with double meaning dialogues. Those films did very well but hum jaise ghar wale log aisi films delkhne nahi jate thay. His films were popular among the lower strata of the society. Then we have a film called 'Grand Masti' about two years ago, that does a business of 100 crores. Itni ashleel film hai woh but multiplex mein chali thi woh film which means that people like you and me went to watch it. So that itself shows what is the level of the audience now. Now they are accepting a 'Grand Masti' and unko wahi dekhna hai.
Taking about nationalism and desh bhakti, do you think the relevance of our freedom exists?
I don't think that the relevance of our freedom is lost. In fact, I feel that it can never go. If people are talking about it, if they are talking falsely about it or even if they are talking about it ‘more’ has nothing to do with its relevance. Independence ki relevance toh hai hi. But the problem is that the youth has forgotten the cost at which we got our independence. Log randomly, without reading, without having the slightest idea or knowledge, start talking ill of Gandhiji and Nehruji. Also kyunki teen saal se hamare desh mein laffazi chal rahi hai na. Jis tarah se laffazi chal rahi hai, sirf bhashan baazi ho rahi hai, woh bhi fake bhashan baazi. Who is benefiting from that? So the relevance of freedom exists but the memories of how we got that have faded. People have to be reminded of that and made to respect that. Abhi hum kahan ja rahe hain? There’s so much communalism. Itna divide pehle kabhi nahi tha jitna ab hai. And that’s the worrying part. That disconnect from reality and of people from people.
So what does freedom mean to you?
It means I should be proud of where I belong to, first of all. As a filmmaker I am doing my bit for the country. I’m making relevant films, I don’t make frivolous films. I don’t make the Housefull kind of movies. So I’m doing my bit for my country. And if I’m allowed to do that, I think that is freedom for me.
When are you coming to UP to shoot?
Let’s see. I have this dream project Milan Talkies which has been in the planning stage since long. Once I finish with Saheb Biwi Aur Gangster 3, I will probably start work on it. Maybe I should start with it here by the end of this year or early next year. I hope the UP government film policy continues. But I also hope that somebody actually looks into it and ensure that only deserving people get the subsidy. Aisa na ho ki sirf subsidy banana ke liye hi film bana di. Aise bhi log hai. So someone or a body should ensure that the film that is applying for subsidy and getting it is genuine and worthy of it. No one should be able to cheat the system and exploit a facility. But the subsidy is a good thing especially for smaller films because otherwise they can never be made due to lack of funds.